Arsenal News 24/7Writer: Rocky7 
Date:Monday December 3 2007
Time: 3:35PM
UK time is: 00:03:35
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FA Should Allow Appeal FOR Red Cards
After reading Amos' excellent piece on refereeing and red cards, a thought occurred to me; should clubs be allowed to appeal FOR red cards as well as against.
Robbie Keane was sent from the field in a rather humorous, but controversial match at White Hart Lane yesterday. The tackle he committed has become somewhat of a talking point, but many seem to be coming down on the side of the Irishman.
Of course Spurs are set to appeal the decision, as most clubs would, but this brings up an interesting thought.
As we all know, the English Football Association is a stubborn bunch, 'cowards' some may say, but at the very least, a daft bunch. Rules implemented by this governing body say that any incident seen, and dealt with by the match official can NOT be pursued any further following the game, effectively calling their referees infallible.
However, rather hypocritically, there are rules in place that allow clubs who feel that red cards awarded to their players have done so harshly to appeal against this decision. Any player who have their red cards rescinded have effectively gotten the FA to admit their officials made a mistake.
So if the FA allow this, why not allow the reverse??
Whilst the Robbie Keane's tackle was somewhat debatable, there was another tackle this weekend that wasn't. As Liverpool put in another impressive display against struggling Bolton, former scouser, El-Haji Diouf committed one of the most horrendous tackles you will ever see on Liverpool's Arbeloa.
In this instance the referee 'saw' the tackle and, rather amazingly, brandished a yellow card. If we are to follow the FA's letter of the law, this issue is now dead. Even though it is quite clear that the tackle was a sending off offence (and, in my opinion, a further five match ban) the Football Association claim 'their hands are tied' (by their own stupid rules).
However, if under certain situations football clubs are allowed to call into question a refereeing decision to have a red card downgraded due to human error, surely it only be fair that Liverpool ask the FA to upgrade Diouf's yellow card to a red, in the interest of continuity.
Or maybe the FA could just abolish this ridiculous 'If he saw it, it's dealt with' rule.
Thoughts? Opinions? Ideas?
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Your Comments
I think you called it right when you say the FA needs to change its daft rules. I dont know how many of the rules are passed down from FIFA/UEFA but it seems that week after week the FA hide behind the 'we're just following the rules' line. Keane will face an automatic ban for a run of the mill foul, while Diouf will face no action for a tackle that was ten times worse.
gazzap
It just makes no sense to me that even the most obvious of red cards that has been appealed against has to be put before a panel, yet when a player who has committed the most horrendous of challenges and gets a yellow card, then their hands are tied "beause of a rule" - "But don't you make the rules?" - "Yes" - "Well can't you change them?" - "No" - "Why?" - "Because our hands are tied". Bunch of buffoons!!
Rocky7
Good point, and high time the rules were changed. I find this appeal process quite pointless anyway - how many times do you actually hear of a red card being rescinded? The FA are simply not willing to admit that the refs are fallible. If their fear is that that would undermine the ref, what they need to understand is that this inability to change the rules is undermining the reputation of FA.
prits
Good idea Rocky. Arsene suggested something similar to eliminate diving from the game. It would be easy to do. We have a dubious goals panel which has the power to change the ref's decision in awarding a goal. Why not a dubious decisions panel when it is clear that the camera angle provides a better view of an incident than the referee had? Reward good play and punish bad play and you end up with better game. There is nothing to fear in such actions.
Amos.
How about they get some qualified referees?Then none of this would be necessary.And their hands wouldn't be tied.
k_chelski
In fairness kev, ref's do have a hard job and are bound to miss things (though ***** knows how the ref at the Liverpool game missed Diouf's "challenge") without wanting to turn this into a ref slagging thread, where is the harm in changing a decision when serious foul play is involved. Players might think twice about being reckless if they knew they could recieve a worse punishment after the match. This crappy ruling only has players thinking if they can get away with it with the refs then they are in the clear. The FA are truly stupid.
Rocky7
The thing is, the F.A (under media pressure I might add, showing where their bread is truly buttered) last season went back on this rule. Thatcher's assault on Mendes was seen by the ref and he gave a yellow card, but after media outcry, the F.A decided they could make an exception and banned Thatcher for six matches retrospectively. So one wonders just how watertight this rule that the F.A hide behind is. I see nothing wrong with giving refs all the help they need.
Little Dutch
I think they need better trainning, that's it.Not just english refs, all refs. Maybe two refs on the pitch?That wouldn't hurt.
k_chelski
Seeing as this thread is regarding cards, are any of you guys watching the Man U game. Rooney blatantly swore at the ref and linesman for an offside decision that was quite clearly offside and it went unpunished. Not only that, Ronaldo was booked for diving rightly or wrongly, but then proceeded to applaud the ref right in front of the refs very eyes. Surely this should be a second yellow card?
flv
And now for exactly the same kind of outburst as Rooney, Fulham's Davies has been booked. Yep, I know I'm picking holes but a bit of cosistency would be a good thing I reckon.
flv
flv - Ronaldo was booked. Fergie claimed Niemi conned the ref into booking CR, but he did that all himself by clapping in his face!!!
Rocky7
They should be able to punish players for bad tackles after the game as well as being able to punish players for diving after the game. Its the only way to stamp it out.
AB_Arsenal
But where is the incentive for Liverpool (in this case) to pursue this further? Perhaps what is required is a review panel to examine replays of each game and punish players retrospectively. Australian Rules "Football", ****e as it is, has such a system in place and the game has cleaned up a lot from past eras where on-field fist-fights went unnoticed. I would love to see this introduced into football to combat such tackles and especially diving...
JakeB
Sorry Rock, I thought he was booked for what the ref thought was a dive not the applauding, in which case that would make two yellow card incidents.
flv
Ah, maybe he was then flv - I noticed the card didn't come out until Ronaldo clapped, but he may have well been booked for diving.
Rocky7
Agree with others that this ludicrous rule should be changed. The FA complains that this would amount to "re-refereeing the game", but surely it would be better for those players who ARE dirty ********s (Diouf is scum, IMO) to know that they could still be called on their actions after the game. It might discourage some of the more disgraceful behaviour.
Moorish
Didn't see the Liverpool tackle, but it couldn't have been worse than the Hunt tackle on Fernandez (I think) a couple of weeks ago. I think the problem with the Keane tackle is down to referees not being man enough to review tapes and down grade card to yellow, the FA will ask Dowd to give his view. If he says it was a bit harsh they will rescind red card, if he stands by it they won't. Also if TV evidence can be used to hang a player, it should also be used to clear a player. I also don’t see why we can’t adopt one of the rules the egg chasers use, i.e. clubs have 48hrs to cite an opposition player for foul play, and there is no reason why this could not happen in football.
Topspur1
Topspur - It was just as bad, if not worse, than Hunt's tackle. Truly outrageous from a piece of filth.
Rocky7
I can understand Keane feeling it was harsh by usual standards and he isn't a particularly dirty player. But the tackle was reckless, unneccessary and could have caused injury. He and others, Arsenal players included, need to show a little more discipline in tackling only when there is a reasonable chance of winning the ball without risking injury to another player. I see the FA have refused Keane's appeal. If this is a hardening of refereeing attitudes then it wil change the culture of tackling in England and the game will only benefit from it.
Amos.
OK, I appreciate that you're having this debate in part to wind up Spurs fans but I do agree with the premise. Players should be liable for further punishment if their sins on the field aren't correctly punished on the field. I've said so for a long time (it's not something I'm just arguing for this week because of El Hadji Diouf escaping a red card for his awful stamp on Alvaro Arbeloa) and I'll explain why. If a policeman sees an incident and acts on it immediately, but then later sees CCTV footage that shows things in a different light then he can act on the new evidence and take the appropriate action. He's not stuck in a "oh well, I didn't see it that way at the time" mentality, his hands aren't forever tied by his initial opinions and actions, and so crimes can be appropriately punished, even if they weren't spotted right away. But in football, it's not like that. Commit murder and if the referee didn't see that it was worth more than a booking at the time then get away for it, no matter how bad the offence turns out to be when viewed on Match of the Day. Result: the mentality amongst footballers (and supporters) that if you can hoodwink an official then it's OK as long as you get away with it. What a great victory for sport and sportsmanship, and what a great lesson for our kids.
Harry P
As I have stated Harry P, the 48hr rules that the egg chasers use for citing players should be brought in
Topspur1
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