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Santos Joins Gremio On Loan

Brazilian left back Andre Santos will join Brazilian side Gremio on loan for one year, with Arsenal having the option to take him back in the summer if they wish. Santos was signed in August 2011 but has struggled to find form this season. He arrived in South Brazil this morning to complete formalities on the move.

Around 50 Gremio fans greeted him at the airport, where he told them, 'I have come to Gremio to be a champion.' Aided by ex Arsenal midfielder Gilberto Silva (who has since rejoined hometown club Atletico Mineiro) Gremio finished 3rd in the Brasileirao last season and are managed by ex Real Madrid and Brazil coach Vanderlei Luxembergo.

Santos could be in line for a debut on Thursday as Gremio play in the Copa Libertadores. According to Porte Allegre newspaper Zero Hora, Gremio began negotiating for Santos in December. Santos joins Chamakh, Djourou, Frimpong and Afobe in having left the club on loan in the last month.

With thanks to @BrazilGunners on twitter.

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Writer: Tim Stillman

Date:Sunday February 10 2013

Time: 1:07PM

Your Comments

Good luck to him. I hope it goes well. It's always good to watch someone with his ability playing with a smile on his face. Shame it didn't work for him but hopefully the conditions at Gremio suit his game a little more.

Amos.

So long, Santos. The action of the manager bringing in Nacho on deadline day must have sent the message. Now, who will we play at LB against Bayern Munich? We can't afford too many changes at the back as we approach crunch time.

Naijagunner

I hope he does well. Such a likable character but just not up to it ultimately. I wonder if he'll take his Smart car with him?

Rocky7

Santos doesn't really fit into the current Arsenal system, so it's a good move for both sides. I only worry that squad depth defensively is stretched now. We've been lucky with injuries so far this season (touchwood), hopefully, that will continue, but this is a big risk by Wenger.

prits

Who plays LB against Bayern? Nacho is cup-tied right?

Arsenales F.C

Vermaelen would seem the obvious choice against Bayern but they could play Sagna or Coquelin there if they had to. If Vermaelen is fit and doesn't get picked against Blackburn then that might tell you something. Ordinarily you'd imagine we might rest a few players against Blackburn but such is the atmosphere among some supporters that maybe Wenger will feel compelled to take it more seriously than he might otherwise be inclined to.

Amos.

Goodbye and good luck, Santos. If Gilberto recommended Gremio, it must be a good place.

FunGunner

Did he really make that comment about coming to Gremio to win titles like he has done in every team he played for, or is someone just quoting him out of context?

Naijagunner

Good luck Santos? Do any of you realise how much that useless **** will be costing this club over the remainder of his contract? You can be certain Gremio won't be coughing up much of his exhorbitant wages.

Wyn Mills

He didn't fit in to the current system cos he was lacking in the ability to tackle, pass, hold a line, cross, awareness of his position - not to mention a general lack of fitness required to play for someone like Arsenal. The players we have out on loan really is a damning indictment of some of the signings he's made over the last five or so years.

shewore

I wouldn't scoff at Santos' pass interception and tackling stats when he was fit and in form (the period before his injury away to Olympiakos in the CL), but he sure was bad at holding a line. That broadside at Wenger is one that can be said of many a manager of a big side today. For any indictment, there are more than 3 you would commend him for. Lets be fair; Santos has won the Turkish league and a few other trophies with Brazilian sides; he is an international. You won't indict a manager for paying £6m for such a player. Lets not forget Fergie paid £8m or more for Bebe. I don't hear him getting slated for that.

Naijagunner

....and if before you say Chamakh, he was an international, came highly rated by everyone who watched him at Bourdeau scoring or making goals in champions league games and was heralded as exactly what we needed. He did start well until the Dutch man recovered and did so well, he couldn't even get a look in.

Naijagunner

*and before* Sorry, that came twice.

Naijagunner

Wengers record isn't too bad especially as he doesn't end up in deficit on transfers.

Amos.

Ending up with a deficit on transfers isnt such a bad thing if you end up with abetter squad. Its ending up with a deficit of players who arent good enough thats the problem. Arsenal are second only to Chelsea in terms of the number of players out on loan. And of those a higher percentage are senior players on 'long term' contracts, as opposed to young players gaining experience. Not such an enviable record.

Wyn Mills

*surfeit* of players, not deficit

Wyn Mills

Haven't City still got Bridge and Santa Cruz still out on loan? Players who don't fit any more are just part of the normal team development or transition. We've always had players intended to serve a purpose that didn't work out for one reason or another Vivas, Jeffers, Stepanov, Reyes, Arshavin and others I'm sure. We don't get saddled with the amortisation costs that some others do while invariably finding they have players that don't fit either. Simply running a deficit on transfers doesn't itself guarantee a better squad but it can make it much harder to eventually build one.

Amos.

You mean those 2 Mark Hughes signings? Selling our best players isn't and making profit so people can point out he's in profit is a bit of an indictment as well to be fair.

shewore

spending more on buying players doesnt necessarily result in a better squad, you're right. But thats a gamble the club have shown little willingness to test over the past 7 or so years. Its much much harder to build a squad if you sell your best players and fill the gaps with expensive others you cant offload.

Wyn Mills

The club bought them not Mark Hughes, just as Chelsea bought Essien and Lukaku and Liverpool bought Carroll and loaned them and others out. The fact that managers don't stay around long enough doesn't mean the club has any less of a problem. How would selling players at a loss be less of an indictment? What possible benefit could that bring?

Amos.

Where did i say it would? But for the sake of argument, maybe selling them at a financial loss, after they've stayed at the club and helped bring a lot of success to it? That definitely would, perhaps not to the business model though.

shewore

Have the club shown a lack of will to gamble on players? Only 5 clubs have a higher gross spending on transfers than we have had since Abramovich bought into the game - and not all of those have done better than we have. Doesn't seem as though the club are afraid to gamble at all. Yet you seem unhappy that they took a gamble on Santos? A bit of a contradiction there maybe?

Amos.

For the sake of argument why not sell them at a profit after they've stayed at the club, given a few years service if they haven't brought success to the club? Sounds like a better business model likely to yield success eventually to me than making regular losses would be.

Amos.

Sure, let's just do that with every world class player we have - who doesn't bring success to the club, sound business planning. The last thing we'd want to do is keep them all playing together isn't it. How is 6m a gamble?

shewore

Only in the febrile mind of a football supporter can spending £6 million not be considered much of a gamble. In truth we've done that to relatively few world class players that we weren't ready to move on or at least weren't pivotal. Probably only Cesc and RvP. Henry and Vieira were past their best while players like Adebayor, Toure, Song and Clichy weren't pivotal players. Others like Hleb and Nasri, maybe Anelka even, we would have preferred to keep but weren't irreplaceable even if their departures were inconvenient.

Amos.

Worth keeping in mind that all the 'senior' players currently out on loan have a year or two after this season left on their contracts. The likelihood is that there'll still be some residual value that the club will be able to realise before their contracts expire so their costs aren't likely to be that exorbitant. The bigger costs are in players like Jeffers, Reyes and Arshavin. Every club has them but we seem to manage that side of things better than most.

Amos.

There you go again with the gross spend argument. What that disguises, of course, is the fact that the club are only spending what they have made on player sales. Which would be ok if they were truly strengthening the squad, but well all know that has not been the case. We have the lowest net spend of any club over a 10 year period. In fact we've spent less than we've recouped in sales. That isn't true investment in my opinion. It's treading water. True investment is keeping your best players and adding more quality. As for senior player costs not being that exorbitant can you really say that with a straight face watching Santos collecting a sizable portion his 60k per week wages from the Arsenal pursor for kicking a ball around for Gremio? He's followed a path well trodden by one Denilson.

Wyn Mills

No wonder the bugger is smiling.

Wyn Mills

In fairness, I actually don’t think on this occasion that we are picking up much of Santos’ salary. Reports in Brazil seem to suggest we’ve been paid a handsome loan fee. Gremio began negotiating for Santos in December, but it got to a stage where the Copa Libertadores deadline was looming. Looks like we held out till they were desperate.

Little Dutch

It disguises nothing when you understand that the club has the 4th highest player budgets in the PL. Your focus on net spend is the disguise because it doesn't allow you see that the simple truth is that only Chelsea, City and ManU, who have greater resources currently, invest more in players than we do. Santos is following a path that's also currently being trodden by Essien, Lukaku, Carroll, Santa Cruz, Bridge, Gomes, Macheda, Fabio, Bebe and has been trodden many times over recent seasons by many other players. It's not a situation unique to Arsenal by any means. You can only speculate on whether Gremio are paying all or part of his wages. One is as much conjecture as the other - and he's always smiling.

Amos.

Your focus on player budgets doesn't allow you to see that despite this we still have a squad which in certain key areas is woefully short in depth. And its not a situation that's unique to this season either. No one can argue with the likes of Utd, Chelsea, and City spending more than we do. Its the Newcastles, Sunderlands and Aston Villas I'm struggling to understand (not counting player's wages, which is a topic all on its own). Would be interesting to see the details of the Santos deal, but it says something about his supposed quality that Gremios have borrowed him out of desperation. I gather we tried to loan him back to Fenebache but they just smiled at us too.

Wyn Mills

I can see that we need strengthening in some areas but not even Wenger is denying that. In all probability we'll always need strengthening which I guess is why we were still recruiting even in the unbeaten season. What is there to understand about the Newcastles, Sunderlands and Aston Villas? What can we learn from them?

Amos.

"we still have a squad which in certain key areas is woefully short in depth" - ah come on, really? I remember in the early Wenger days (the more successful ones) having 12-14 decent players in our squad, and the rest filler. Arsenal's squad is stronger than it's given credit for - just not playing very well.

damiano_tommassi

I agree that Wenger hasn't been able to get the best out of the players he does have this season, we are better than the results we've got.

shewore

It's been very clear in some games, eh Shewore - where we've conceded 4 goals in the first half and scored 7 in the second! Or as a longer-term illustration, a lot of people have been unhappy with Ramsey for six months - some wanted him gone(!) - but now he's back in form it's clear to see he's a decent footballer.

damiano_tommassi

Ramsey is decent, needs to want to get forward more though and work on his speed of thought/and or distribution - it also helps when he's not played criminally out of position. He was unlucky not to score at Sunderland, he was reeling away as if that shot was in, was gutted for him.

shewore

yeah, looked every inch a goal.

Of course he will play better in his favoured position, but I don't think game-time in other areas is a bad thing (long-term), in terms of learning to deal with new situations and see things from a winger's perspective (for example).

damiano_tommassi

Maybe it betters the player but it doesn't do the team any favours for the 90minutes. Fabregas played on the right of a 4 a few times when he broke through but obviously had much better players to play with. It certainly didn't help Eboue, who I blame for every single problem Arsenal have had over the last 5 years.

shewore

Absolutely, yes; it's an investment, like playing Theo wide until he learns not to fall over(!).

damiano_tommassi

Santos is a very likeable chap, indeed. He took time to leave a very emotional THANK YOU video knowing he was leaving at short notice. Nice touch.

Naijagunner

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