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Arsenal 3 - WBA 0

Premiership

Emirates Stadium

5/11/11

Attendance: 60,091

Referee: Oliver

Arsenal
3 - 0
WBA
Van Persie (22), Vermaelen (39), Arteta (74)
 
 
Venue: Emirates Stadium
 
Attendance: 60,091
The Teams
Szczesny
 
 
 
Foster
 
 
Vermaelen
 
 
 
Olsson
 
 
Kosciely
 
 
 
McAuley
 
 
Santos
 
 
 
Jones
 
 
Jenkinson
 
 
 
Reid
 
 
Arteta
 
 
 
Morrison
 
 
Walcott
 
 
78
 
Brunt
 
 
Ramsey
 
 
71
 
Thomas
 
 
Song
 
 
 
Dorrans
 
 
80
Van Persie
 
 
 
Gera
 
 
63
Gervinho
 
 
72
 
Cox
 
 
71
Substitutes
Fabianski
 
 
 
Fulop
 
 
Mertesacker
 
 
 
Shorey
 
 
Djourou
 
 
 
Dawson
 
 
Rosicky
 
 
71
 
Tchoyi
 
 
63
Arshavin
 
 
78
 
Mulumbu
 
 
71
Benayoun
 
 
72
 
Thorne
 
 
80
Park Chu-Young
 
 
 
Fortune
 
 
Game Statistics
12
Goal Attempts
9
7
On Target
4
4
Corners
1
12
Fouls
12
0
Yellow Cards
0
0
Red Cards
0
59
%
41




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The Journalist

Writer: Arsenal Site Staff Mail feedback, articles or suggestions

Date:Saturday November 5 2011

Time: 5:06PM

Your Comments

Chuffed
Sajit
I said I would never write on this blog again because of all the hatred towards the best manager we have or will ever had as the Boss (IMHO). You rocky janelle and others were ready to push him out are your opinions still the same or are you having to eat that HUMBLE pie with a giant spoon full for mouthing off??
alwaysgunner
More importantly is that it was another clean sheet and GD is back to positive territory
HK_Gunner
Here's the thread alwaysgunner is talking about http://www.arsenal.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=525424 As everyone can plainly see there is no hatred of Wenger from anyone there, just a critique of many failings which was completely justifiable given the appalling run of results which seemed destined to continue unabated from last season. Utterly ridiculous tabloidesque sensationalism to say there was hatred of Wenger.
nikolaijns
Eat humble pie? For beating a clueless WBA at home? lolz
Sajit
Loved Wengers interview after the match.. We need to be humble and try our best. First place is too far away at the moment.
Sajit
It might be sensationalism to describe a failure of confidence in Wenger as hatred but it was also a little sensationalist to be contemplating relegation as was the case at the time. We've picked up 15 of the last 18 PL points. We can't be absolutely sure we won't be right back in it in a few months time but if it's all right to over react when things are going badly then you can't blame others for doing so when they appear to be going well.
Amos.
Still feel we are on a knife edge. Our season depends on having a fit RvP throughout.. And you know that has not happened in his 7 seasons so far.
Sajit
I don't think it's really impossible to overreact when you lose 8-2 tbh. A few jokes were made here about relegation I'm sure I made one myself but did anyone here seriously give it as a potential reality? I doubt it. Given the shocking half of last season which merged effortlessly into the start of this one, given the fact we sold two of our three best players with only a half hearted desperate last transfer days' activity to counter that, I'm in no doubt whatsoever that the thread in question and feelings of those raising doubts over Wenger were more than justified. This was no grumble of a 3 game loss, this was the outcome of 6 months of atrocious form and years of selling our best players with little of the ensuing profit being reinvested directly into the squad.
nikolaijns
The doubts were perfectly understandable. The problems were/are bound to raise plenty of doubts and any grumbles justifiable. But it's equally justified for alwaysgunner to ask whether opinions are now as definite as they were a few weeks ago.
Amos.
Well mine are that's for sure, Wenger and Arsenal between them massively ballsed up a crucial summer and failing to invest in quality to replace the obviously departing talent. A negligence that served to give us our worst start to a season in over half a century combined with our most humiliating loss in as many years. This was 100% avoidable and I'd like someone to stand up and take responsibility. Our recent improved run doesn't rewrite the history of what happened there. That's what I felt at the time and that's what I feel now.
nikolaijns
The question is for the few million that we saved on our deadline day desperation, was it really worth the worst start to the season in over 50 years, the most humiliating defeat in longer and the utter erosion of goodwill towards the manager in particular? Was it really worth it? Obviously no, in no shape or form.
nikolaijns
Niko, it is not like the Manager knew, for sure, that the club wouldn't have convinced Nasri to stay or that Barca was going to stump up acceptable cash, just at the tail end of the window. The poor start was down to the exertions/distractions from the Manager's efforts to keep "our 2 best players" and the rsultant feeling of despondence in the team when their mates left. Once we brought in the new players, albeit late and rushed, it was always going to be a matter of time before the trust (in one another) developed and the quality came to the fore. We fans needed to have shown more understanding as you don't just buy players (as some suggest) in anticipation of your captain's departure; that will be sending the wrong signal to him and his team mates.
Naijagunner
It was widely accepted Fabregas was off this summer, whilst the Nasri episode may have been a bit of a curveball it happened with plenty of time to draft in a replacement. So one player we knew would be off and one player we felt would be off halfway through the summer. Failure to play hardball with Barca cost us, I also totally disagree with the assertion that you don't buy in anticipation of Fabregas' departure, well if you're a club that pinches pennies and doesn't like to be held to ransom, well yes you very much should. We've had since the start of his last season ie Aug 2010 to line that up and failed dismally. Who cares what signal it sent to Fabregas? He wanted out so forgive me for not caring about hurting his feelings. The signal it sends out to team mates is that the club has it all in hand and under control.
nikolaijns
Ah! And thanks for bringing up that thread Ag was on about. For me, it was one of the most shocking debates I have seen on this site (no offense intended to those who aired their views); I remember going to bed thinking I will either need to avoid all the negativity before I started to believe it too. If you ask me, it was a "momemnt of truth" kind of article that was intended as a therapy of sorts; you always knew after that, what a precariously knife edge situation the club was in. Good thing we have stemmed that tide.
Naijagunner
* either...or just roll with it.
Naijagunner
It could also signal that the club won't do much to retain players' loyalty; but will go on to buy replacements and dare players to move. The message will be it is okay if you keep seeking the next move since we won't mind as we have your replacement already bought. Then there is the signal to the likes of Ramsey, Wilshere and Rosicky, who were our long term replacements, anyway. You see, it would be wrong to assume we needed to buy Cesc's replacement, for instance when we all agreed there is no player like him but that we had good close replicas in Ramsey and Wilshere. We did have the player quality required to sustain a better run; it was the timing of the departures that unsettled the team.
Naijagunner
It could also signal that the club won't do much to retain players' loyalty; but will go on to buy replacements and dare players to move. The message will be it is okay if you keep seeking the next move since we won't mind as we have your replacement already bought. Then there is the signal to the likes of Ramsey, Wilshere and Rosicky, who were our long term replacements, anyway. You see, it would be wrong to assume we needed to buy Cesc's replacement, for instance when we all agreed there is no player like him but that we had good close replicas in Ramsey and Wilshere. We did have the player quality required to sustain a better run; it was the timing of the departures that unsettled the team.
Naijagunner
What players' loyalty are we talking about here? Both players wanted out and did little to hide it. Arsenal always knew this was the window in which Fabregas would go, I'm sure Wenger had an agreement with Fabregas as he did with Henry, that being serve one more year then go with my blessing. We sold him for a pitifully low amount which suggests Barca also knew of this agreement and fannied about making insultingly low offers knowing cesc had to be sold as Wenger is a man of his word. Let's get something straight in an off season a player is not going to know what moves their club is making in regards to approaching other clubs, our players have no feckin idea who Stan Kroenke is, so it's safe to say boardroom negotiations aren't going to feature highly on their radar. They will not need to know of any replacement until the door already hits their arse.
nikolaijns
Maybe "loyalty" is an alien word these days, but call it what you like, I'm sure you get my drift. Nothing is ever conclusive in the world of player transfers and who's to say we couldn't keep both players? To say "I'm sure Wenger had an agreement with Fabregas........Barca also knew of this agreement" says nothing as it is pure presumption said only to make the argument. No way any one of us could have known what agreement Wenger may have had with Fabregas. We all feel we could have done (and wish we did) better during the summer but short of kicking out our captain for peanuts and simply taking the first good offer for Nasri, the long drawn out saga was why the club got the sums it got for the players and why our deals were hurried; City only came in after United had suggested interest in Nasri with much less than what City paid; Barca's first offer was derisive and we had no choice in Cesc's destination. It was a difficult period for everyone, including (especially, actually) Wenger.
Naijagunner
Loyalty is an alien word if you are dealing with two players who don't want to be here. We couldn't have kept Fabregas a year longer as Wenger had already got him to stay for this one final year. It's a presumption but you'd be naive not to presuppose this was the case. He badly wanted out at the end of the '10 season and we all fully expected him to go then but he didn't and many others not just myself have presumed he stayed at the behest of Wenger who he felt he owed (so yes that proves I'm aware of the concept of loyalty:) ) It's pretty apparant to me what agreement was had with Fabregas, lad wanted out last year, Wenger talked him into staying. Same as with Henry, wanted the Barca move as what he saw as his last genuine shot at winning the CL, Wenger asked him to stay as it was to be our first year at the Grove and we needed his name to ensure the move went smoothly and with our star name, as with Cesc, Henry knew he owed Wenger his everything and agreed to stay that final year. We did 'kick out' the captain for peanuts everyone knew it not least Barca who had the feckin cheek to boast about it shortly after. Nasris' move was unfortunate only in that it happened in the same timeframe as cesc and only made our lack of judgement in not already lining up cescs replacement look even more foolish. Even before Wilsheres' injury most of us were in agreement that it was suicidal to expect such an inexperienced pair to carry our midfield for an entire season. Anyhows I'm done arguing the toss. These will be my beliefs until/unless Wenger comes out with evidence to the contrary.
nikolaijns
Haha Niko! You sure are entitled to your beliefs; much as I am mine. I think we should all just enjoy this period in our resurgence and hope it lasts very long.
Naijagunner
No argument there bro.
nikolaijns
It's much more than a fair bet that there was an agreement between Cesc and Wenger that he could go last summer - if the terms were right. There was also an agreement that Vieira could join Real Madrid. Contracts were even exchanged between Arsenal and Real but PV decided not to go at the 11th hour - so nothing is done until it's done. That said, just an observation but if Cesc's replacement was always intended to be Ramsey (it has been so far this season) then maybe the failure to line someone else up (who would have replaced him anyway?) was just an acceptance that there fewer better alternatives than Ramsey genuinely available. In which case strengthening the overall squad as best we could (assuming there was a point when other preferred targets finally proved unobtainable) was only ever going to happen late. Whatever view you take on the summer transfer dealings it's perfectly understandable that AG should draw attention to the possibility that things might not prove quite as negative as they might have appeared to be just a few weeks back.
Amos.
Here I go but no hatred people asking the boss to go every one including the editior saying its time only a few so it seemed in my opinion who where prepared tostick up for the boss. Countless tims Amos tried to show with data how things were not as bad as some thought. And when I said , if you care to look back what all the fuss was about as we had some terrible luck with injuries all I got was that I was a dummy for believing in the boss. When you have followed this team as long as Amos and a few other old timers, and had to ride the roller coaster of success and failure (important point never relegated since 1919 when we were promotion; no other club including the manures Liverpool Chelsea ) then I think we have a case to perhaps we might know what we are talking about. If now and until the end of the season we dont do as well as we have in the past it will still be and always will be the finest club in the world to me. Question nicko would you want the boss to leave now???
alwaysgunner
Would I want the boss to leave now? Well I have to be consistent as with my Cesc argument and say only if an agreement is in place with his replacement first :) If I'm brutally honest Arsenes' glory days are behind him, and I don't see us winning another trophy with him. I also have no faith in the likes of PHW to unearth the new Arsene, we have no footballing men at board level any more so my faith in them finding Wengers' replacement is negligible. Nope the only bloke that will find Wengers' replacement is Wenger himself! Such is his power at the club, he's here til he wants no longer to be. I wanted Wenger to turn the ship around and if he couldn't do that then to do the decent thing, he's since gone on to do it so it stands to reason it would be self defeating for me to want him to leave at present, but I am and was fully supportive of anyone that wanted to raise questions no matter how painful or unpalatable they may have seemed, but that's just me, blindly following has never been my strong point.
nikolaijns
Am afraid I second Niko here.
Sajit
I do though completely agree that such is Arsenes' testament and legacy at Arsenal then I have no problem in him choosing his successor, & that if 'Piksi' is the guy that Wenger wants when the time comes then that is good enough for me. Difficult part as ever is knowing when is the time. http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_6732855,00.html
nikolaijns
I'm glad someone brought up the old post... I've wanted someone to say 'told you so' for a while now. Our manager is one of the best. now we've won an arseload of games, there are far fewer Spuds on here telling us we'll get relegated, and far fewer Gooners asking if (or emphatically insisting) we should sack our best ever manager. Because his team-talks are out of date. Because he doesn't understand tactics. Because he hasn't moved with the times. Because he won't p1$$ 50mil on a striker. Because Koscielny 'is awful'. Well a month on, and with something like our first-team available we're winning games - who'd have thought!

There are still those who are of the opinion that the whole summer was a balls-up, Arsenal were on a knife edge - and probably people who will still tell you Wenger should go. but it seemed to me a (media led?) over-reaction to a bad run of three/four games.
damiano_tommassi
Oh FFS!! will you please stop trying to say this was only a reaction to this season??? It grossly insults the intelligence of those that had to witness the appalling self destruction of last seasons' 2nd half and a summer of sitting on hands with tissue stuffed in ears. This kind of positive 'sweep it under the carpet' propaganda is just as depressing to witness as the medias' polar opposite campaign.
nikolaijns
Find me one quote in the history of VA from anyone that has suggested we spend 50 million on a striker. It's just pathetic damiano.
nikolaijns
Niko, are the words 'self-destruction' yours or Jeff Stelling's? What self destruction? I'll give you an 'Oh FFS!!' situation - each year, Arsenal compete on all four fronts. They tend to lose the Carlin Cup in either the semi or final, the Champions league in either the last 16 or against Barca, and go far in the FA cup. Now, in years where Arsenal don't win any of those competitions - like the last 6 years - this means that we exit all of the competitions within a month or so. And the press call it 'self-destruct' or 'meltdown'. the insinuation, of course, being that if you get knocked out of the FA cup in the first round, the CCup second round an the Champions' league in the first knockout round, that this is a better performance for a football club. It's bull***** mate.

I think you need to better appreciate the success Arsenal have had over the past six years - in spite of not winning a trophy.
damiano_tommassi
Niko - I mention the figure '50 million' because there are regular calls to "SPEND SOME ******** MONEY!!!!!". The club spend money on players each year, whether it's 17m on Arshavin and 10 on Vermaelen, 12(?) on Oxlade and 17(?) on Gervinho, but no-one's ever satisfied. So I like to draw a parallel with Chelsea spunking 50m on Torres (or, if you recall, the massive fee paid for Shevchenko) to illustrate that throwing a big chunk of money at new players doesn't automatically solve a club's problems. peope wanted us to buy Chamakh a year before we did, for 10m, rather than wait and get him for free.
damiano_tommassi
We self destructed in the CC final. We had the competition on it's knees, it's defence utterly knackered on it's last legs and we self destructed and gift wrapped it for them. I would have said the same thing before any media reported it and have no argument if that was the way it was reported. I was actually talking about pushing the self destruct button in the league post that CC loss, cups are cups and you can progress or be eliminated, that's part and parcel of football. The slide down the league following the final loss and the point tally of 12 out of a possible 33 from 11 games seeing us slide from 2nd to 4th is hard to sugar coat any other way than a self destruction. But hey, whatever reality gets you through the day ;)
nikolaijns
So you choose to mention the most extreme figure spent by a sugar daddy to illustrate that spending money doesn't work? It's just ridiculous. We spent 50 million on the last day in desperation what you should be asking is whether it would have been better not to jeopardise the start of our campaign by pinching pennies to spend a little extra say 60 million as opposed to 50 mill to get the same players earlier in the window, to give them time to bed in pre season and give the team a fighting chance to get a result at St James' or at home against a resurgent Liverpool or avoid the OT humiliation which to my mind is an unquestionable YES!
nikolaijns
Or to fine point the matter. How much is that 8 points that we basically threw in the 1st 3 games going to be worth come the seasons' end? I would wager a lot more than the 10-15 million pound scrimped from not doing our business until the windows' bitter end. I'm still really struggling to get a grip on the clubs' thinking over the summer, I just can't get my head around it at all. We've had a horror show run since the end of February, by all accounts player mutiny is rife in the air and fan morale regarding the team and manager is at a nadir. If there was ever a time to win everyone back onside it was this summer, get deals and business done early, shift those on that were going and settle the squad in pre season for what the club had known for some time was going to be a very tricky opening period to the new season. I disagree with this whole mentality that we let the russian and the sheikh and the Yank family Leprechaun feast at the table first and we wait til they are sated, deals can be made to happen quickly and quietly. I really hope this was a one off and not a new strategy of redknapping about like pikeys rummaging through the deadline day debris for scraps. Very unseemly.
nikolaijns
Nicko you have an opinion which is valued as a comment but thank ******** christ you are just an opinion. In H.C. days some stupid fan wrote in that'(after four consecutive wins that the four players who had contributed to these success should be dropped'sound familiar.(AW should now find the person to succeed him as he is now unfit to do the job, or words to that effect. I wonder ( and I dont mean to be rude)is that old fan a relative of yours? Look at our results and thank goodness the boss never listens to Dumb Aarse opinions like yours.
alwaysgunner
"We self destructed in the CC final" = 'a player made a mistake and Birmingham scored a tap-in'. In the same way as Chelsea self-destructed against Arsenal when John Terry fell on his ass? Is that all it takes to qualify?

"pushing the self destruct button in the league" - you mean losing some games? That happens. Particularly when confidence is low. You know, like when your own supporters don't support you. 'Sliding from 2nd to 4th' is self destruct? Is that not a slight exaggeration?

"So you choose to mention the most extreme figure spent by a sugar daddy to illustrate that spending money doesn't work?" - no, to illustrate that it doesn't ALWAYS work, and isn't a solution to every problem. "We spent 50 million on the last day in desperation" - we've been tracking Mertesacker for over a year, Benayoun's signing had been agreed weeks beforehand, Oxlade-Chamberlain had been scouted for over a year and tried to sign him in the previous window, if I recall, Arteta signed as a direct, experienced, established premier league player; I don't see desperation there. The players COULDN'T BE SIGNED EARLIER IN THE WINDOW, and EVERY CLUB MOVED FOR THEM LATE. but if you're asking me do I think it's worth 10,000,000 to have a couple of players come in a month or two earlier, then no, I don't think it is; you could run the youth academy for years, drop ticket prices, buy countless other clubs and players for that kind of money; why ***** it away trying to hardball other clubs for the sake of getting a player a month earlier?

8 points lost at the start of the season is disappointing, and if it means we finish 5th instead of 4th this year (for example) then it will have cost us tens of millions. Are you going to tell me that if we signed the players earlier, for more money (if that was at all possible) that we would not have dropped those points? That Gervinho wouldn't have got riled by the journeyman pikey-scumbag Joey Barton reducing us to ten men? I don't see it would've made a massive difference.

"10-15 million pound scrimped from not doing our business until the windows' bitter end" - you're talking out of emotion and ignorance; you do not know the circumstances (unless you were closely involved with the transfers).

"by all accounts player mutiny is rife in the air and fan morale regarding the team and manager is at a nadir" - not sure where you're getting that feeling? The players all seem happy to me, saying positive things regularly, celebrating together after the Chelsea result, etc. What are the rest of us not seeing??

"I disagree with this whole mentality that we let the russian and the sheikh and the Yank family Leprechaun feast at the table first" - Juan Mata. We scouted him, approached his club, were in the process of agreeing terms for him - then Chelsea offered more money. If we get into a bidding war for a player with City, say, do you think we can afford to pay the transfer fees and wages that they do? Do you think we should pay those fees? You can't out-bid someone who has ten times your money.
damiano_tommassi
@alwaysgunner, absolutley nothing said there of any relevance to anything I've posted, quite a feat bravo! I've never suggested dropping any form player to my knowledge. I also haven't suggested Wenger find his replacement, I don't need to as he's already done it so rather pointless tryting to tarnish me with that. You obviously have no ability to discuss anything without resorting to insult, surely you should know better at your age? @ tomassi yep when Malouda played that terrible back pass & Terry slipped I'd classify that as a self destruct, it was a terrible mistake and a game changer in much the same way that ches and kos made their clanger. Losing some games happens for sure, 12 out of a possible 33 from 11 games at the business end of the season is falling apart, self destructing, bottling it. I'll try and go through your points individually tiresome though they may be...Mertesacker could have been tied up before pre season, like you say tracking him for a year, no reason to wait until the season had begun, ditto benny, ditto Arteta (although here is likely where an over payment would have been made but for such a crucial MF position where we had lost two big players one I'd class as worth paying slightly over the odds. You don't call moving for 5 players on the deadline day after only picking up 1 point from the 1st 3 fixtures desperate? well I do. You admit it yourself there it will cost us tens of millions if we finish out of the top 4, that is obviously why we get business done earlier or at least before the start of the season. Only one person talking out of emotion and ignorance here (well 2 if you count alwaysgunners diatribe) and that's you son. It's safe to assume that based on the value and final price of the players that the price would be higher earlier in the window agreed? Considering we brought in 5 players then it could have been as high as 10 mill extra but 10-15 mill would not be a surprising figure in todays market no? It's an educated guess as I'm sure Everton would have asked for at least 5 mill more for Arteta alone had they not been caught on the hop. Wenger himself admitted he came home to mutiny with half the squad wanting to leave in the summer, I'm only reporting what he said. Mata we quibbled over 2-3 million again before Chelsea even got involved, stop trying to rewrite history again. We dawdled over 1 matchdays income. We snoozed we losed. Could have been tied up early but we dicked about and lost a fantastic player. I don't think I've ever agreed on one solitary point you've ever made damian weird that? even spuds that come here I'll agree with once in a bluey, you strike me as a bit of a fantasist in all things Arsenal and someone else utterly incapable of rationally discussing any mistake the club has made.
nikolaijns
Anyways my piece has been said and i hope our form continues to Norwich away, this has been rather tedious trawling through our recent turbulent history but I just can't let the wholesale revisionism of it by the likes of damian go unchecked because, well like all revisionism it's a lie.
nikolaijns
"benny... could have been tied up before pre season" - getting off to an awful start there. You're just dead wrong. Chelsea weren't going to release him until they signed Meireles from Liverpool, it was not possible to sign Benayoun earlier.

"You don't call moving for 5 players on the deadline day after only picking up 1 point from the 1st 3 fixtures desperate?" - no. Because it wasn't. You can spin it that way all you like, but it doesn't stand up. Oxlade is not a desperation signing. Nor is Mertesacker, who we've wanted to sign for many months (according to the player himself). Benyoun is a temporary position-filler, and had been planned for weeks (according to the player himself). Arteta was a direct replacement for a departing player, who has a wealth of experience in the PL and is a leader which everyone says we're crying out for. Park is a 2.5m punt on a back-up striker. Santos an experienced full back (although he has made himself look a bit of a tit so far). But no panicking. maybe if we'd have thrown money at the clubs for these players, paid inflated fees to try to get them earlier, THAT would be panicking.

"It's safe to assume that based on the value and final price of the players that the price would be higher earlier in the window agreed?" - not sure what you're asking me. if it's 'are players more expensive at the start of the window or the end?', I'd say probably at the end after you've been through a bidding process. If you can sign a player for 5m, he's yours. If someone else offers 5.5, then you 6, then 6.5 you might well find yourself delaying a transfer because you're in a bidding war. That you might not win, because some clubs spend more money than they've ever earned.

Could you do AW the courtesy of using his words, rather than "Wenger himself admitted he came home to mutiny with half the squad wanting to leave in the summer" which is most likely out of context? Isn't that what he said about Nasri and Fabregas - who aren't here now, in case you've not noticed, so the point is lost. You might as well talk about the negative effect of having Adebayor in our squad.

Not sure why you're coming out with aggression and put-downs (I can only assume you don't know how to have a coherent argument as opposed to a row, but no-one's 're-writing history'. Your words and opinions are not fact, sir, they are opinions. And most of them are uneducated. As I understand it, the Mata deal died because of the personal terms on offer, as opposed to the transfer fee, and AW was very sore about it.
damiano_tommassi
It is reasonable to assume that had we tied up players before and taht if we had got them to have a pre-season we wouldnt have had to play Frimpong against Liverpool and start Traore and Coquelin against Manchester United. It is reasonable to expect that we woundnt have been in the position we are right now. Despite the good run, we find ourselves in 7th position...
Sajit
Agreed Sajit, 100%. I'm saying that wasn't an option.
damiano_tommassi
Ooh well if it's courtesy you wanted knock yourself out, Wenger in his own words for you, a plethora of sources to choose from http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&sugexp=ppwl&cp=28&gs_id=27&xhr=t&q=wenger+arsenal+player+mutiny&pf=p&sclient=psy-ab&source=hp&pbx=1&oq=wenger+arsenal+player+mutiny&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.,cf.osb&fp=62a5e4b366e6b2e5&biw=1144&bih=587
nikolaijns
Again your revisionism of history is a fail. AOC wasn't one of the five deadline signings. Benayoun, Chu, Arteta Mertesacker and Santos were. Leave AOC out of the argument he was signed early in the window so all good. Players are cheaper earlier in the window lol joker if that was the case we'd have signed players on the windows' opening day wouldn't we?. I know we were after Mertesacker for a year so why did it get left to the last day? ditto Santos. Anything goes tits up in either of those deals and we're right up brown creek. Would we even have got the two midfielders had it not been for the OT drubbing? Highly debatable. The whole thing reeked of panic, unless you're saying all were our primary targets, which they blatantly weren't. Chelsea would have released Benayoun earlier no problem - he just isn't really rated there, and if they weren't then you've just enforced my argument that it was a last minute scrabble given that Meireles only signed on the last day. Are you really telling me that's a suitable way to do business? That there aren't any equally decent midfielders that we could have got in the squad to bed in earlier?? Your words are as much guesswork and opinions as mine so it's futile to claim you are factually in the know because it's a lie. I haven't been at all aggressive, look at alwaysgunner if you want aggression. I've merely labelled you a fantasist, who has viewed this year as a well planned great success story.
nikolaijns
Nicko Nicko I will try to make it simple for you. A fan in HC days saying drop those four players is as stupid as you saying get rid of AW. Do you understand now; if HC had followed that fans advice it would be the same as your advice about AW going .
alwaysgunner
Niko, you're incapable of rational argument, and at a guess, rational thought. All these assumptions and nonsense... you're ignoring facts because they don't suit you. Sad.
damiano_tommassi
No damian you are ignoring the facts because it obviously pains you to much to admit the recent mistakes and shortcomings of the club, now who is being insulting? I'm capable of viewing the situations of this year and forming my own adult viewpoint. You are toeing rigidly some party line inflexibly, afraid to question and admit where situations could have been vastly better handled. You have issued me ZERO facts, just your own opinion, you know nothing of Chelseas' transfer situation but presume you do, you knew nothing of Wengers' admission that he faced a mutinous summer but mocked me for knowing it and made poor assumptions of it's validity (probably because it didn't appear on the official site baaaaa) I have received no apology for that. According to you a fact is that AOC signed on deadline day when he penned way before but I'm supposed to believe you know what you're talking about? Your last post is an indication of a failing argument and of a boy in complete denial. I have argued my points rationally and clearly whereas you have sought to made utterly Zilch points of your own, merely looking to negate my presumptions with wilder ones of your own. That's sad.
nikolaijns
Alwaysgunner alwaysgunner and I will make it simpler for you, I didn't even comment on the article which saw you flouncing off in a huff. I have my views on Wenger some will agree on some some will disagree on others, difference between us is I will defend the rights of others to pen articles whatever their view at the current time and you don't. That's the difference between us. I can read constructive criticism of our club from a site like this which I respect and you can't. End of.
nikolaijns
 

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